Forum discussion from BetSeventyTwo.

Laying the field video

by macdady » Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:23 am

Morning Badger,

Just a quick question regarding this video. Do you have a any specific selection criteria for the races you choose when laying the field?

Mac

by The Badger » Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:11 am

I usually stick to races of 5 or 6 furlongs and more than 10 runners. Handicaps are good because in theory they should all be in a blanket finish. You can use 7 furlong races as well. At carnival times, like Ascot, Goodwood, York etc.. when you have big fields and high class racing there are a lot of close finishes and it works quite well.

by dakc47 » Tue Aug 04, 2009 9:36 am

Well here you go…this was a totally new to me aspect of trading that I had never seen before. Another Badger technique to add to my trading armoury…excellent. Exactly why I joined this website…the more I learn the happier I’ll be.

Great insight Badger. Thanks.

by ljones85 » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:10 am

Hi Badger. Just watched your video, and interesting as I used to do the exact same system of 5f, 6f races with lots of runners. I spent a few weeks doing it for little profit and so decided to do martingale carry system on it. This lost me money!

Do you refine your selections even more than just big fields and short races?

Thanks in advance

by The Badger » Fri Aug 07, 2009 9:13 am

I usually like to choose big handicaps of say 10-12 runners or more and stick to 5 or 6 furlong races, maybe 7.

In the big carnivals like York, Ascot, Goodwood, Newmarket, you get some very close finishes.

So while I do use it sparingly, on the right races, it goes well.

by Darren » Thu Aug 20, 2009 11:48 am

Had a little dabble yesterday, worked very well Badger, cheers. Useful weapon to have in your armoury!

Did a quick couple of videos too – click here to watch them

by The Badger » Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:00 pm

The important thing is picking the right races. No outstanding favourites, the top four or five all priced together and not just trying to do it on every race.

by jaybee2 » Sat Aug 22, 2009 8:00 am

I had a go yesterday it worked very well until I started chasing my losses I stopped after losing £5 and the next race would have won my money back.

Ill be having another go today starting with £0.50 and using Gruss software.

by Darren » Sat Aug 22, 2009 8:36 am

The Badger wrote:The important thing is picking the right races. No outstanding favourites, the top four or five all priced together and not just trying to do it on every race.

Yes good point Badger, this is not a blind strategy but pick the right races and could be a decent little earner.

by The Badger » Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:37 am

jaybee2 wrote:I had a go yesterday it worked very well until I started chasing my losses I stopped after losing £5 and the next race would have won my money back.

Yes chasing is the scourge of traders. Many a bank has been wiped out doing that!

Just pick the right race and you will be ok.

by hudders » Tue Aug 25, 2009 2:37 pm

I looked thru todays card & the only race I thought matched up for this was the 15-30 @ Southall. I managed 4 matches @ 1.8 & am more than happy with that.

by Darren » Tue Aug 25, 2009 2:43 pm

Nice one, yes the key is certainly to be selective in your race choice.

by The Badger » Wed Aug 26, 2009 9:06 pm

Great stuff Hudders, used correctly it really works a treat. well done.

by hudders » Wed Aug 26, 2009 9:50 pm

The Badger wrote:Great stuff Hudders, used correctly it really works a treat. well done.

Cheers, did 5 races today resulting in 3 losses, 1 two horse match & 1 four horse match. Basically broke even using this today.

I’m going to see if I can use any further criteria or spot any trends.

by ljones85 » Thu Aug 27, 2009 7:04 am

Hi guys,

I have been using this for 6 days now, and am 14 points up. I select any race up to 1m with more than 8 runners, and with no clear fav.

It’s working for me at the moment, and the beauty is I can carry on at work and check at the end of the day!

by The Badger » Fri Aug 28, 2009 7:07 am

That’s a great idea, set it up before going to work. The only minor flaw I see in it is if there some late non runners, but overall, great plan.

by smcc3573 » Sat Aug 29, 2009 6:32 am

I had one quick question related to this which is how to set it so bets stay, I believe its bet persistence but I cant find anywhere on Betfair with some examples of how to set it. If anyone could just give me some advice it would be greatly appreciated

by ljones85 » Sat Aug 29, 2009 7:43 am

Badger, I can still look at the internet at work so I just log in every hour and check the prices havn’t shortened, and if they have I just re-adjust them. It looks a lot better just loggin in for a couple fo minutes than sitting there constantly putting the bets in.

I don;t have any trading software and only have betfair basic. Do you know any free software that I canm put lay in at 1.8 and it just fires them all straight in? it takes ages typing them manually in to betfair

update: still 16 points as had a point loss and then a point win in last two days

by hudders » Sat Aug 29, 2009 2:35 pm

smcc3573 wrote:I had one quick question related to this which is how to set it so bets stay, I believe its bet persistence but I cant find anywhere on Betfair with some examples of how to set it. If anyone could just give me some advice it would be greatly appreciated

If you input your bets pre race it gives options of cancel, keep & sp.

Just click the circle to keep.

by corner123 » Sat Aug 29, 2009 7:13 pm

I’ve given this one a try a few times and had a good day at York when all 3 races I tried had 2 or 3 horses matched. However despite choosing races very carefully, those are the only 3 races I’ve managed to pick with more than one horse matched. I did 4 today and all lost me money, so I’ve decided this system really is not for me. I obviously find it hard to identify the right races, despite (or possibly because of) a long standing in depth knowledge of the sport.

Hope everyone else who tries it has more success than me.

by The Badger » Sat Aug 29, 2009 8:39 pm

Sorry about that Corner. Maybe you know too much and you don’t do races for a certain reason that others do and win on.

It is certainly not any sure fire system, there are none. Believe me. Trading is by far the better option.

But people often ask for a system that works and whilst I only did one race today due to doing other things I got 4 matched.

Now I realise that was just very lucky and had I done the race before or after I would have lost!

So use it for a bit of an interest in a race but don’t plan on buying a new house from it!

by hudders » Sat Aug 29, 2009 9:53 pm

The Badger wrote:Sorry about that Corner. Maybe you know too much and you don’t do races for a certain reason that others do and win on.

It is certainly not any sure fire system, there are none. Believe me. Trading is by far the better option.

But people often ask for a system that works and whilst I only did one race today due to doing other things I got 4 matched.

Now I realise that was just very lucky and had I done the race before or after I would have lost!

So use it for a bit of an interest in a race but don’t plan on buying a new house from it!

Today was bad for this and of the 6 races I did 4 were losers with only 2 matched in the other 2 I did. I was looking to try identify if there was any reason behind this as every other day this week I’ve obtained profit.

Not come to any major conclusions sofar thou wondered if the amount of money in the markets had effected any or if it was just a bad day.

by ljones85 » Sun Aug 30, 2009 9:59 am

I had a terrible day yesterday and lost all my profits. bit annoying

by corner123 » Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:04 pm

Thanks for the reply Badger – I suspect the race you did was the 3.35, which I avoided because it had a shortish priced fav and was not a handicap.

Yesterday looked a good day for this system, which is why I gave it a go. several competitive handicaps with plenty of runners, but they all seemed to go along the same theme – one horse went clear in the final quarter mile, and nothing else got a look in. I’ve noticed that the races which match several horses are those where the winner comes from the back late and fast, but identifying such horses beforehand would be very time-consuming and there would be no guarantee it would happen. I wouldn’t think its worth the time.

It would be interesting to know if any particular race courses favoured this system. I did well at York, and have noticed before that there are plenty of close finishes there.

by The Badger » Sun Aug 30, 2009 2:37 pm

Yes I advised four trades yesterday on my trading service and they all went under, it looked a great day on paper.

I also think there are a lot of people doing this system now and traders are waiting to later in the race to start backing which means we may need to raise the lay limit slightly. Try to match them at 1.80 or something.

by hudders » Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:20 am

Did anyone try this yesterday? I had to miss and wondered how people got on.

by The Badger » Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:02 pm

Not me mate, corner scared me off for a while!!!

by corner123 » Wed Sep 02, 2009 6:24 am

The Badger wrote:Not me mate, corner scared me off for a while!!!

Oops – sorry about that.

by smcc3573 » Sun Sep 13, 2009 9:58 am

Hi I tried this yesterday on 23 races…. just picked a selection upto about 1M 2f distance limit and min 9 runners picked handicap and non handicap. I posted this also but no one responded so if anyone is interested here are the results cards picked were

Wolverhampton

Chester

Goodwood

Curragh

Doncaster

and I had the following results

13 Unsuccessful

9 successful

net profit of 16Eur on stakes of 10 & 15Eur Odds to match were 1.4

of the 9 successful Distances were

4 non Handicap

6f/7f/7f/5f

5 Handicap

7f/6f/5f/1m 2f/1m

for the unsuccessful only 2 were under mile distance and only 3 were not handicap races.

In summary ideal races appear to be upto 7f, as for number of runners, I didnt experiment on races where there was less than 9 as i dont think it would yield a profit, there was no major difference on whether handicap or not. Maybe this was down to distance as a lot of the handicap races that lost were more than 7f.

my biggest success was FfosL 14:05 with 4 matched which wasnt a handicap.

I realise this is hardly a thorough sample of racing over an extended period but I wanted to share anyway If anyone else has other opinions on ideal scenarios for laying the field then I would like to hear.

I plan to run another sample next week with slightly higher odds (1.55/1.6) to see if there is a higher hit ratio. I will also look exclude all races that are 1m and above.

by The Badger » Sun Sep 13, 2009 7:19 pm

That’s a great effort. Thank You. I feel 5f and 6f are best, 7f is ok and above that I don’t do.

by corner123 » Sun Sep 13, 2009 9:01 pm

I had one more go at this yesterday on the 22 runner 5f Portland Handicap in which the joint favs started at 7-1. The field split into 2 groups and the race looked ideal, but only one horse matched 1.4 for 80p loss (£2 stakes).

I seem to have a talent for losing on this one.

by dakc47 » Sun Sep 13, 2009 11:40 pm

I too thought that this race was made for the lay the field approach…at one point I thought there was going to be a real blanket finish with several runners being matched…but not to be…still, plenty more races to try it on…

by The Badger » Sat Sep 19, 2009 10:32 am

I am going to try this on the Ayr Gold Cup at 3.10

Let’s hope for a ten horse photo finish

by hudders » Sat Sep 19, 2009 4:16 pm

The Badger wrote:I am going to try this on the Ayr Gold Cup at 3.10

Let’s hope for a ten horse photo finish

I missed this race, was it successful?

by corner123 » Sat Sep 19, 2009 8:09 pm

Not absolutely certain but I checked the figures on this race and I think the 2nd horse, beaten a head, matched down to 1.7.

by The Badger » Sun Sep 20, 2009 6:36 am

You are right Corner. Anyone that placed trades at 1.70 or above got two matched. Me, well i was a bit tighter and layed all at 1.60 and got gubbed. Never mind, them’s the breaks.

Terrible day yesterday, lost £427 on racing and made £460 on football and £103 on Rugby Union, at least I got rewarded for watching Australia get hammered!

by corner123 » Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:56 pm

The Badger wrote:You are right Corner. Anyone that placed trades at 1.70 or above got two matched. Me, well i was a bit tighter and layed all at 1.60 and got gubbed. Never mind, them’s the breaks.

Terrible day yesterday, lost £427 on racing and made £460 on football and £103 on Rugby Union, at least I got rewarded for watching Australia get hammered!

Sorry to hear that Badger, hope you have a better day today. Not seen you in the live chat for a while – I guess you are busy. I’m still there most of the time if you want tea and sympathy (well, maybe not tea…)

by Darren » Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:18 pm

I almost forgot about this strategy. Was just trading a bit of the footy last night, spied the 8:50 at Kempton and looked like a race with a possible close finished, laid the field for 1.8 with £20, got 3 matched, over £21 profit (had done some earlier trading on the race, with a £2.94 loss) mustn’t forget about this great little strategy!